ADN

Man raum, you've got to open up a topic about El-Sellam Ha-Yakkobh, its one of the most fascinating of all stories in the bible, and out of it..And I don't think we've ever discussed it in depth...

huh?

huh? what..?

Yeah, "Huh?" doesn't give us a lot to go on... :roll:

Raumy-son... got a Q for ya. lol When and why did Muslims split into Sunnis and Shi'ites, and why are there more Shi'ites than Sunnis? If I remember correctly, they represent about 85% of Muslims.

hmm, I answered this last night, as I understand it.

I am by no means a scholar of Islamic history. Everything I say on the subject tends to be regurgitated from various casual glances at books on the subject, and discourse from others whose Opinions I trust, but do not necessarily express.

My friend Nathan, a UC Berkeley student who has read more works on Islam that anyone I know (even the muslims!) gavew me this general understanding.

The division of sunni and shi'a is one of who was left in charge of Islam. it started in about the seventh century AD.

Mohammed said some praising things about Ali Ibn Ab Talib, his son in law, and the Shi'a take that to mean Mohammed intended for Ali to be left in charge of Islam. But the majority of people didn't feel that way.

Mohammed's father-in-law by the name of Abu Akbar (who was father of Mohammed's six year old bride, Fatima) gained support and became first Caliph, and passed leadership to his family, not the family of Ali.

Sunni believe Abu Akbar was to be the first Caliph, and consider his support as indication of his Islam.
Shi'a believe Ali was, and Abu Akbar was corrupt, and ulterior motives lay behind his rise to authority.

Anyways, empirically, Abu was the first Caliph, who had ordered the Quran compiled.

Then, came the second Caliph, who suprisingly was not Ali, but Umar, a relative of Abu Akbar, not Mohammed.

Then came the third, Uthman, who had his men rebel against him. Then, Ali was made the 4th Caliph (if you count the first three, which the Shi'a do not always).

This is all predication for the islamic civil war, or fitnah.

Then, some other group (Qwarish?), who opposed the Quran's authority, and held that the "religion of Islam" was becoming a shame to the teachings of Mohammed, accused Ali of conspiracy to kill, or at least not prevent the death of Uthman. So, they targeted him for assassination. After Ali was dead, they ran for their lives, and through constant struggle, the sect known as the Qwarish (or something like that) fell apart through bickering of what is Islam and what isn't Islam. These groups are largely ineffectual, and many were reabsorbed back into the Sunni.

The death of Ali is a BIG deal in Islam, so they hit themseves in the head with machetes on the anniversary of his assassination. I don't know how this helps. *shrug*

It is also my understanding that over 80% of muslims are Sunni, and there used to be more Shi'a, though the Sunni were still a majority at that time as well.

Allah word should be comes thru Summeria(as my opinion)
during the long historic time and probably contain at two word
Al-Ilah(w can see some of similar words in Hebrew n other languages)

But I dont know as where comes GOD word???

Also in Islam religion has lot of sub parts such as Sunni n Shia;
-Hanbali-Maliki-Shafi-Hanafhi and many other(those fm sunni)

These look a like such as Ortodoxs,Catholic,Gregorian,Protestant and other....and also their sub parts as well.

Allah/God the owner of the all creation/cosmos!!
Alhamdullilah

Al-ilah is a good bet for where Allah comes from, but Al-ilah comes from the cannanite root "L", pretty much all the ideas of sumerian language come from the Akanichu, or the Phoenicians. this b

The word GD is the basis for the word "God" and that comes from Ge-d Hu, which means "I call upon you"

The word God does not appear as a synonym to Deity, until its popularity in Europe, with the Gott of the Germanic peoples. Before that Theos in Greek became Deus in Latin, merged with Vater in Nordic, and sort of "became" Gott, which later was softened by the Celtic languages.

Elohim is the word in the bible,.. and comes from El-ihu, which is synonymous with Al-ilah.

but islam's conquering of a pantheistic people was not without its confusion... allah was already a name fo the self same deity. my favorite rendering of the "There is only one" idea of monotheism is used by a friend of mine who is a naqashbandthi sufi from Bangladesh.

"For the clarity of my heart, there is but one name I call God, and the name is Allah."

that, I personally respect.

Yes Raum I agree with y n we just respect for all happens as well+
Bye

All right, so we have a quiz on Monday, and I have some blank notes because his powerpoints aren't always the easiest to see... and I sit at the front. lol

Do you know the Shiah Imams? I have 8 of the 12.

1. Ali
2. Hasan
3. Hussayn
4. Ali Zaya-al
5. Mohammad
6. Jafar al-Sadiq
7.
8. Ali-al-Sadiq
9. Mohammad al Taqi-al-Jawad
10.
11.
12.

Also, do you know what Tarqah and Haqiqah mean?

Finally, I jotted down some notes while we were watching a video. Can you check to see that I have everything spelled and identified correctly? lol

Fahtu: conquest
Haythem: discovered how the eye actually works
Ulhambra: Catles in Spain, which features some of the best Muslim architecture
Al-Hakim: ruled Jerusalem, and ordered the holiest churched in Christendom burned
(Don't have the name): crusade catles in Syria
(Don't have the name): Arabic word for cheque
Saladeen: gathered 12,000 soldiers to battle the crusaders
Mongol Catastrophe: the rampage of Asia and the Middle East in the 13th Century
Dip-shevis: recruiting children for military service

Thanks man.

A couple of corrections: Fatimah was the Prophet Muhammad's daughter.....not his wife. She was also the wife of Ali. (the 4th Caliph in Islam). Thus Ali was the son-in-law of the Prophet Muhammad and also happened to be his cousin.

In regards to the Sunni-Shia split:

Both Sunni and Shia Muslims share the most fundamental Islamic beliefs and articles of faith. The differences between these two main sub-groups within Islam initially stemmed not from spiritual differences, but political ones. Over the centuries, however, these political differences have spawned a number of varying practices and positions which have come to carry a spiritual significance.

The division between Shia and Sunni dates back to the death of the Prophet Muhammad, and the question of who was to take over the leadership of the Muslim nation. Sunni Muslims agree with the position taken by many of the Prophet's companions, that the new leader should be elected from among those capable of the job. This is what was done, and the Prophet Muhammad's close friend and advisor, Abu Bakr, became the first Caliph of the Islamic nation. The word "Sunni" in Arabic comes from a word meaning "one who follows the traditions of the Prophet."

On the other hand, some Muslims share the belief that leadership should have stayed within the Prophet's own family, among those specifically appointed by him, or among Imams appointed by God Himself.

The Shia Muslims believe that following the Prophet Muhammad's death, leadership should have passed directly to his cousin/son-in-law, Ali. Throughout history, Shia Muslims have not recognized the authority of elected Muslim leaders, choosing instead to follow a line of Imams which they believe have been appointed by the Prophet Muhammad or God Himself. The word "Shia" in Arabic means a group or supportive party of people. The commonly-known term is shortened from the historical "Shia-t-Ali," or "the Party of Ali." They are also known as followers of "Ahl-al-Bayt" or "People of the Household" (of the Prophet).

From this initial question of political leadership, some aspects of spiritual life have been affected and now differ between the two groups of Muslims.

Shia Muslims believe that the Imam is sinless by nature, and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God. Therefore, Shia Muslims often venerate the Imams as saints and perform pilgrimages to their tombs and shrines in the hopes of divine intercession. Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for a hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders, and certainly no basis for the veneration or intercession of saints. Sunni Muslims contend that leadership of the community is not a birthright, but a trust that is earned and which may be given or taken away by the people themselves.

Shia Muslims also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Muhammad, based on their positions and actions during the early years of discord about leadership in the community. Many of these companions (Abu Bakr, Umar, Aisha, etc.) have narrated traditions about the Prophet's life and spiritual practice. Shia Muslims reject these traditions (hadith) and do not base any of their religious practices on the testimony of these individuals. This naturally gives rise to some differences in religious practice between the two groups. These differences touch all detailed aspects of religious life: prayer, fasting, pilgrimage, etc.

Sunni Muslims make up the majority (85%) of Muslims all over the world. Significant populations of Shia Muslims can be found in Iran and Iraq, and large minority communities in Yemen, Bahrain, Syria, and Lebanon.

It is important to remember that despite all of these differences in opinion and practice, Shia and Sunni Muslims share the main articles of Islamic belief and are considered by most to be brethren in faith. In fact, most Muslims do not distinguish themselves by claiming membership in any particular group, but prefer to call themselves simply, "Muslims."

Hope this helps.