ADN

There have only been 2 things brought up about me as being wrong opinion wise... Kobe and Golf. What else would you like me to talk about? I've been picky about where I post, I've tried to back up my opinions with articles now since that is what is loved here, and I stand by my point of view. Nothing more I can do but defend it now.

Give me some credit... I've even budged a wee little bit on my golf opinion.

golf is certainly a sport. for why? because the players involved are athletes. some may not be as finely tuned in every way as they probably should be, but they're athletes all the same. don't judge these people by their body shape, and compare them to one sub-set of athlete (a quarter back is just a sprinter/power-house whose body is designed for repeated but very brief bursts of energy). instead look at long distance runners and sumo wrestlers. both are clearly athletes by any definition of the word, and neither fulfils this narrow stereotype of the muscle bound performer. golfers have to share atributes of both long distance endurance and power play, which means they have very different bodies to quarter backs. though if you want a buff golfer then look no further than tiger woods, whose domination of the modern game is leading many to question the current training regimes of other leading golfers.

btw those 80 year olds are almost certainly not playing with any great regularity, and are probably using a golf cart to get around.

HHHMHMMM... I move a step closer to recognizing golfers as atheltes. but it still isn't a "sport" as Americans define the word.

And, the old farts would if I were there. I've be passing out steroids like M&M's telling them it was Viagra. They'd be teeing off at 400 yards.

I think I like tt's idea: Talk what you know...

If you're going to trash a sport, fine...YOU'RE RIGHT...It's your opinion...But why you feel the need to trash a sport you've NEVER played...Damn man, why is that not clicking in your head that's not something you should do..?

Picuture this: Some guy is completely TRASHING the military experience by saying shit like, "Man, surving combat isn't that hard, I go to level 3 of Metal Gear on Playstation wihout so much as even getting sniffed...How hard is it to hold a damn gun in your hand and drop the first person you see not wearing your colors w/a fucking HEADSHOT..! Blam..! Being a soldier isn't a job...All you have to do is hit the target...I'm no marksman, but I as at my air conditioned shooting range the other day, and got 4 shots in the bullseye...

Said person then laughs in your face...Like this...Muahahahahahahahahahaha....

Maybe if you had joined the thread, and said, "Hmm, golf ain't that hard, I was shooting on the course the other day and shot -15 under my first time out...Guy on the course said it was the best ever, yet, I feel like taking a crap would have been harder...But you have constantly repeated what I feel is a completely detremental to you carrying on this conversation, which is : I have never played a game of golf in my life...

You can say what you want...Free country...This is what forums are about...But how is it you expect anyone to repsect what you say, or do you even care..? I think that's what we're all trying to decide...

But for argument's sake, based on your logic, a baseball player is not an athele also, cause I don't see what the difference is between a golf swing and an at bat...

Baseball players are probably athletes to him because they run the base paths after they hit....which is what...if you're AMAZING....40% of the time?


I stand corrected on my baseball player issue.....but I think we might have opened a can of worms with this one.....either that or one of contridiction.

thank's Ty, you gave me my first laugh of the day.

ruff, I ain't trying to say you can't have an opinion, even an opinion with no backing. but honestly, few sports will get me in more of a "sports-talkin" mood than golf, and pub games. and I rarely have someone bring it up. so when you bring it up and got nothing to say but down play it, expect me to get you about that. but that ain't about you... that's about gowf. I am not trying to change your opinion, I am trying to voice mine, which is based in playing and practicing the classic gentlemen's sport.

I can't throw a rock in a swimmin pool when it comes to basketball, and never really needed to, so I don't even carry an opinion about Kobe other than dude is always in the spotlight, and usually not for what I consider good reasons, but everyone I know or see that knows basketball admits his skill. you got me up on that one if he is selfish, and I don't care to get up on it, so I just bow out of that.

I meant from a sports fan standpoint, not a players standpoint.

Alot of sports fans don't really recognize golfers as atheltes for whatever reason. Why is baseball athletic... because someone is throwing the ball at them with different spins and locations on the ball each pitch. Nobody is doing ANYTHING to make the golf ball harder to hit. In fact, the course has to be almost freakishly silent when the player is hitting. The whole game seems to be surrounded by helping the player out. I mean ya, the course may be crazy hard, but there are no other elements that add to the difficulty of the game other than the course.

I don't think playing a round will change my view, but I'd be willing to try. If a baseball player was hitting off a tee, then I would say he isn't an athlete at that point. I mean Softball Guy isn't an athlete either to be honest. Is someone throwing a ball... yes... but come on... they are lobbing it up there at a cool .25 MPH and the danm thing might as well be as big as a beachball.

Baseball is very different than golf to me because the target is not stationary and golfers have nothing in the field of play to hinder the ball from landing safely or in a good spot. When I, as a fan, think of an athlete, golfers just don't come to mind. From my point of view, there is nothing, other than the course, that makes the game of golf harder or easier for the golfer. Nobody is allowed to heckle them, nobody can bother them, and they get forever to look over the hole and decide what to do next. it's chess with exercise.

Dude, how easy is it to sit back as a fan and talk shit about the guy you see on TV doing something you never can do..? And let it be known that an athlete is someone who plays a sport, regardless of whether or not you feel its physical enough for you...So, saying Tiger Woods is an athlete is 100% correct...If you are arguing if Tiger is athletic or not, I'm still going to have to disagree...You don't know what kind of regime that man has to do the things he does, obviously its something, cause he's kicking everybody's ass...

ruff, a guy shooting 3's in a gym....Alone...At a stationary basket...Will not make every 3 pointer...In a game situation, a guy at home with no jeering, will not make 100% of his free throws...The basket is not fucking moving...You are 15 feet away, doing something you do for a living...The form and motion is the same, yet, you will not make every free throw...Is that not countering your golf argument good enough..? What's the difference between shooting a free throw, and tee'n off...Once, outside in my yard, I made 40 free throws in a row...Do you even think for one minute i thought I could go to the damn NBA..? Ala, your "i could go to the pga" argument..? Nobody taught me how to play basketball, I picked up a damn ball and practiced, and got decent...So, in terms of skill...Which is harder...??

If golf was so damn easy, you don't need a teacher...Go teach yourself, get good, and make the damn tour...

Right or wrong..?

So how is it you keep coming up with these ridiculous expressions of validation..? Golf isn't a sport cause the ball is standing still..? How the fuck much sense does that make..? For that matter, how hard is it to make a free throw..? What you are underestimating is the perception of pressure...You have absolutely no frame of reference for it, not many of us do...Some people feed off of pressure, and some do not...

QUOTEThe whole game seems to be surrounded by helping the player out. I mean ya, the course may be crazy hard, but there are no other elements that add to the difficulty of the game other than the course.

Its not helping the player out. It is letting the bagger get as intimate with the game as possible. Golf is a game of intense concentration, and the discipline needed to play should not be underestimated. Here, let me see if I can explain in a frame of reference you likely have.

In boot camp,.. you get dropped and pump floor till the ceiling cries, right? and that is hard and passionate and can break a lesser man, when he slips in a puddle of the sweat pooling up around his wrists, yeah?

well, also you get stuck in Attention, unable to move, no matter how much they try to get you break ranks. its like the ultimate frustration, and when you get past it, you cultivate discipline. that is the refinement found in Golf.

If Football is like Shao-Lin-Kung-Fu, Golf is like Tai-Chi. What you come in contact with is not a physical opponent.

In Golf, the elements that add to the difficulty of the course are the wind, the humidity or precipitation, the slope, the experience with the course, the person's ability to shut out the distraction outside of them, and inside; there are wind qualities most people will never be aware of. Golf teaches you alot about yourself. it shows you what the true measure of maturity is. It is not a game of bravado, but it is physically demanding to peg a decent 175+ drive off all 18 tees, much less keep it in play.

and equipment advantages are usually only helpful to people good enough to keep in play 9 holes deep... and most of the people you seem to put on the course can't stay 3 deep. (That means they can't play 3 holes of golf without the ball going in the sand, the water, or the goddamn woods.)

Ok... here is what I am willing to do.

Golf is a sport, but golfers, in my opinion, are not athletic in the sense of common American thinking of an athlete. Maybe that doesn't make sense... but it does to me. We tend to think of Athletes as a select group of people in our little club (I know that feeling), while golfers are on the outside looking in. People who play golf are passionate about it and people who don't play will never understand.